The last day in the Alps and a ferocious stage with hardly a metre of flat road.
If you want to watch it live, note the early finish.
Pacman: a group of 42 riders were away with Lidl-Trek pulling for Mads Pedersen who’d made the move and managed to get over the big Col du Noyer. Among the group was Lenny Martinez, 7th overall at the start of the day. Valentin Paret-Peintre won the sprint on the climb to take a virtual lead in the mountains competition.
Several riders from EF, Ineos, Visma towed the breakaway as fast as they could for their climbers which was a boost for Martinez. Having worked to pull the move clear for Pedersen, once past the intermediate point Lidl-Trek, Pedersen included, dropped back to pull the yellow jersey group which shrank drastically on the modest Col d’Ornon, a clue to the pace and fatigue, to try and recover time on Martinez.
The breakaway started Alpe d’Huez with about three and half minutes on yellow jersey group and soon Martinez, Richard Carapaz and Sep Kuss left the others behind. Only they quickly started to attack each other, notably Carapaz who was frustrated by Martinez who was either baggage or bluffing. It was a bluff, and Carapaz made five moves, increasingly frustrated as he could not get away. At one point through the village of Huez the trio stopped pedalling as they looked at each other.
Meanwhile Pogačar had set off solo, it was like watching an Australian-style handicap race where the best rider has to set off minutes behind the rest. In yellow, he was gobbling up riders from the breakaway like Pacman. Extrapolating his time gain per kilometre suggested the breakaway would be caught but you didn’t need mental arithmetic to work this out as the lead trio marked each other and buried their chances.
In the finish Carapaz and Martinez were able to latch onto Pogačar but he kicked one last time before the finishing straight and cracked Carapaz. Martinez was on the wheel of the Ecuadorian again and he probably took a pleasure in not moving and thereby ensuring Martinez could not win. Another stage for Pogačar. Easy to bank, to take for granted, to read as inevitable but this time with the Alpe record too.
Among the GC contenders Remco Evenepoel came in two and half minutes down, taking 12 seconds on Isaac del Toro and 16 on Mattias Skjelmose and Paul Seixas. The relative loser was Juan Ayuso who lost almost four minutes to his GC rivals, slipping two places on GC. Martinez is up to fifth now and his Bahraini team management swept away all talk of a loss thanks to this overall gain.
In the mountains competition Richard Carapaz leads by one point over Tadej Pogačar and seven points over Valentin Paret-Peintre. Carapaz has 91 points and there’s the possibility to win 70 points on Stage 20 so all to race for. Pedersen now has 52 points lead on Jasper Philipsen, not arithmetically secure but much more comfortable now.
One sour note was Einer Rubio leaving the race after the UAE team car slammed on the brakes going up Alpe d’Huez, seemingly when a spectator was in front of the vehicle and the Colombian crashed into the back, sustaining heavy facial injuries and, unable to continue, needing 20 stitches. The upper part of the Col de Sarenne for the next stage is due to be closed to the crowds.
The Route: 170km and 5,450m of vertical gain, a huge day in the mountains. The profiles speak for themselves.
The Finish: the Col de Sarenne is a backroad that leads to Alpe d’Huez and very different from the famous main climb. It’s irregular along the way with an early descent and a flat section through Clavans. The upper part in black on the profile has a series of hairpins that come in quick succession.
From the top there’s still 14.4km to go, first across a plateau-like section that’s awkward as anyone dropped before can flounder by themselves here.
Once in Alpe d’Huez there’s a descent out of the ski resort and then the route picks up the final part of the traditional climb with 3.5km to go, some last ramps before crossing the resort to the same finish line as the previous stage.
The Contenders: Tadej Pogačar (UAE) has his Alpe d’Huez stage now, does he want another? Speaking after Stage 19 he hinted at this but also said he wants to help Isaac del Toro secure the white jersey and the podium.
Richard Carapaz (EF) has been on the rampage two days in a row which makes a third time hard especially given all the efforts he’s been making but by virtue of being in the polka-dot jersey he’s got to be among the movers from the start.
Valetin Paret-Peintre (Soudal-Quickstep) sat up on Stage 19. Did he fade from the efforts of pushing a big gear, or was it a case of reculer pour mieux sauter knowing how many points are on offer in this stage?
Lenny Martinez (Bahrain) was almost carried to the foot of Alpe d’Huez on a Sedan chair but stuffed up the finish. However his time gains have propelled him up the GC and so if he moves both Lidl-Trek and Decathlon-CMA CGM will want to chase. Still he is moving well.
Sepp Kuss (Visma-LAB) gets even more climbing to suit and no GC menace.
Netcompany-Ineos can still try, is Thymen Arensman the best bet or did Egan Bernal sit up yesterday to save energy. Both are climbing well but how to win against others look livelier.
Tom Pidcock (Pinarello-Q36.5) is 9th on GC and at 21 minutes and he could take eight minutes and not worry Lidl-Trek or Decathlon but he’s just been struggling on the climbs in recent days.
 |
Kuss, Carapaz |
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Pogačar, VP-P, Martinez |
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Pidcock, Arensman, Bernal, Del Toro |
Weather: sunshine at times and 27°C in the valleys but with clouds building and a good chance of rain at times.
TV: KM0 is at 11.30am and the finish is forecast for 4.10pm CEST. The start of the Télégraphe comes around 1.40pm and the top of the Galibier will be around 3.00pm and the Sarenne begins around 3.35pm.
I hope this record stands the test of time…..
Considering he took it off of Il Pirata, it’s not exactly like what you are insinuating isn’t already the case for the record that was broken.
Pas normal for sure.
In the table of record times I saw the top 17 times, prior to Pogacar’s ride, were all from 1994-2006 – an inauspicious period of cycling – and by the likes of Pantani, Armstrong, Virenque, etc. So don’t worry yourself too much.
PS Paul Seixas almost certainly did the fastest ever ascent of the Alpe by a 19 year old. But I don’t suppose that will worry anyone unduly.
A time of 39 mins is legit. 38 is suspect already. Everything less is an insult to intelligence. I trust riders like Sastre, Evans, Pinot, Moncoutie, Carapaz who all rode around the 39 mins mark. Even IF, and this is big IF, we accept the advances in technology, training methods etc. (which I do not buy one single iota, because these were all very advanced a few years ago and these records are being obliterared by MINUTES), I would accept 38 mins to be at the border of human limits. 35 min is a complete and utter farce.
Hmmm. So Landis and Kloden’s 38:35 in 2006 is not legit? Armstrong’s 37:36 in the 2004 ITT ascent is dubious (and, by the way, officially expunged anyway)? How about Armstrong’s 38:03 from 2001? Of course, Pantani in 94, 95 and 97 (all around the 37 minute mark) are all sus, right? How about Jan Ullrich, 37:40 in 1997? Alex Zulle 38:04 in 95?
Remco did it is 37:54 yesterday. Evidence of foul play on your argument? Or how about Seixas’s 38:10 from yesterday?
In 1986 Hinault and Lemond, a famous finish, took 48 minutes dead.
If you read carefully then you might notice than I can accept 38 as within the realms of human limits taking into account advances in technology and training. What I do not accept is the leap from the years 2012-2018, which I consider the only normal years in cycling’s recent history, to the current level. The bikes were extremely good then, Sky was at the forefront of training, nutrition (marginal gains), and yet the performances from that period have risen by 10-20%. This cannot be explained just by the arguments from the current mainstream narrative. But nobody seems to care, no critical thinking, all is good as long as the money flows.
Have you some sort of analysis about the plausibility of climbing the alpe clean that you couldn’t be bothered to type into a blog, or did you just choose a completely arbitrary time?
Listen, I’m not being flippant. I take your point seriously. Any rider out of the blue suddenly riding over one minute faster than a known doper (Pantani, who had the three fastest times on Alpe d’Huez before yesterday and who was considered its fastest ever climber – clean or otherwise) must surely raise questions. Froome and Quintana were riding the Alpe in around 39 minutes (Carapaz yesterday was 38:55). I just wonder if we can be so dogmatic about a cutoff time for “human limits”. Not all humans were born equal and the “human limit” will necessarily be a human outlier.
Nutrition with Sky was very different to now. There was a podcast with Geraint Thomas and an Ineos nutritionist and they were laughing at what was done then compared today. This doesn’t explain everything but worth noting as today’s high carb racing is different.
Sky has been proven to be systematically doping their riders and also with a radical sense of impunity (which is one of the most impacting factors, often well above the technology used).
But they then supported mediocre athletes.
Doping normally brings you just up to a certain point.
It’s true that, as in Armstrong’s case, they also acted to tamper the doping possibilities available to rivals, which probably lowered general times.
However, checking any records table will suggest that barring some very specific exception, normally on some given day, doping doesn’t shift too much the pecking order of talent.
The worst impact is on competition and relative to unfair attitude across teams.
Gabriele I love you and enjoy your comments but I just think this is simply not exactly the case and you should word this better – we all know you dislike Sky which is fine, but it is simply not true that it’s been proven they systematically doped – their titles still stand, their ex riders are part welcomed as part of the Tour caravan and it’s clear the wider sport does not (yet) agree with your assessment. I’m not saying you’re wrong and know your arguments but it is more nuanced than your statement reads and if it wasn’t none of the above would be the case. You may well be proved correct in time but we need to acknowledge the gradations of difference between the systemic doping of Postal and others and what you allege at Sky.
I also think you’re better than calling any riders in the peloton mediocre athletes, it’s so disrespectful, all the riders we’re watching are performing herculean feats just to ride the race, can we not just be a little bit more polite?
@oldDAVE
I haven’t written “blood doping”, about which we only have some hints, or “cover up of doping positives” which wouldn’t be exact although it’s what happened with Froome in essence. I haven’t written GH though I might be thinking about it for some reasons. Who knows, some days you could even suspect about a motorised bike, high RPM, always seated, short top effort time… All this is personal opinionated conjectures.
What is *not* conjecture is:
– “Systematic”, like when you use institutional favours as the poorly motivated TUEs to abuse corticosteroids with total impunity. It’s not like you were tempted on a given day to take a pill more. It’s premeditated and organised. With big paperwork (to say the least…) in order to get impunity from the UCI and complex logistics across Europe to move doping products.
Systematic is having big quantities of forbidden testosterone (which was established in a trial to be destined to athletes) delivered at a public venue. Which also shows the sense of impunity.
All by the *team doctor*. All presumably stored on a laptop you need to destroy. The mere fact you stored it there shows what “systematical” and “impunity” mean.
(Just compare it with, dunno, the Fuentes situation.)
That said, which is useful to state because it’s facts, let me add that I’m ROTFLing big time with your further arguments.
No title were retired ex post for Rabobank systematic doping or T-Mobile’s. Many of their athletes, or doctors, or DSs are now respected members of the peloton (as they were of Team Sky, by the way).
Time might prove if my suspects of the first paragraph should be added or no to proven charges about Sky. But what several fair courts or commissions with full judiciary validity have already proven beyond reasonable doubt is more than enough to place Sky where I place it. Surely in a more damning place than, say, Riccò when features like “impunity” and “systematical” is what really concerns us.
Now do Dr Ferrari Gabriele.
I’m sorry Gabriele, I simply do not think this is the full story.
I know you will repeat it endlessly and certain aspects do warrant further investigation, but I’m not going to argue each and every time, especially as John’s comments earlier this tour summed it up far better and more knowledgeably – the only reason I am commenting now is because there feels like a lot of new and very welcome commenters here this Tour, and I don’t think it’s fair to be talking about Sky like Postal as you have a habit of doing, whether or not we’re talking about blood doping. There’s a wider story than any comment here can give an overview of, so really I just want to voice disagreement without getting into the argument, as I know I’m not alone here in thinking.
It feels like the most recent generations are increasingly getting spoken about in the same breath as Armstrong, with a few here even talking about Visma’s ‘systematic doping’ with a shred of proof (not you obviously) – and I just want new members of this community to know we do not all agree with you on Sky’s history, as well as to put up a little bit of a screen to the past fifteen years being spoken about like the previous twenty, as things felt radically different to me as someone who saw both.
@oldDAVE
I must imply that what’s quite telling is your absolute lack of arguments besides “I prefer newcomers to ignore facts”, just as John’s actual or faked ignorance about everything which was established during the different Freeman’s trials. That was so amazingly fact-blind that I thought that John was recurring to AI.
To be clear, I don’t place Froome in the same category of Lance, not even close. He didn’t sit down to negotiate personally with the big guys or have any NADO director removed. But I’m not focussing on the athlete, here. The two systems had much in common which also produced a set of similar consequences.
That said, as Froome was just “part of the machine” I wouldn’t take the results away from him. His case was more about the need to punish the team and authorities, if anything, not the rider.
@Bubble Wrap Ferrari is hugely interesting and has been tackled by me and others a number of times. But until oldDAVE jumps out defending that it’s all-oh-so-nuanced or that “there’s a wider picture” to deny him being a doper, well, I don’t feel the urge.
I have absolutely no opinions on Ferrari. I just want to talk positives in a great last stage – but just to be clear, I have no arguments above because this goes in circles, I know I would never change your mind Gabriele and there people far better placed in these comments to speak on this than me.
I simply want to express to new comers that other opinions are allowed and other viewpoints are also welcome here.
I value many of your comments and insights, but you’re also extremely rigid in your views and rarely listen or change which can come across as unintentionally quite didactic when not all things are as black and white – which makes it easy to forget it’s okay to disagree with you without needing to get into a long drawn out argument.
But I really enjoyed your Coppi post so let’s just celebrate a fun end to the tour.
@oldDAVE, I am very rigid against info manipulation.
You’re still trying to sell out as “opinions which may vary” what isn’t at all (not within the current Western academic and legal framework, I mean). Opinions are also legit, but I normally try and take care separating what I share.
I have also noticed that this is the official cycling-related media approach to manage embarassment and predicament produced by what other institutions had to investigate and prove as the sport had no intention to do it.
May I add that inrng’s usual “no trial by blog”, as rational as anything can get, may become a bit absurd when we have had at least a little share of trials (and so much was skipped!) but people just prefer to ignore their existence.
As several people have worked hard to obtain a limited portion of what we can call “facts” – be it only within our limited Western paradigm – avoiding them to be wasted is just a minimum commitment to “servicing history”.
Come on Gabriele, you’re being so disingenuous – you never come on here and talk about Contador, you never talk about Quintana, there are hundreds of cyclists we could talk about – but it’s always Froome and Sky, and I think what you’re not acknowledging is this is a English language blog where a number of British fans, and I assume commenters here, were brought to this sport by the success of British cycling in 2008 and then Sky – so to constantly go after them on here of all places, especially on a day when they are totally irrelevant, is just goading fans who just want to enjoy the day? I don’t believe it’s intentional, and everyone should be welcome here whatever nationality, but I think you might find it suspicious if British person turned up on Italian cycling blogs and went after Pantani whenever the opportunity arose? As if they were looking for a conflict or to make people feel bad for liking someone? I don’t think you’re doing this on purpose, but you should be aware of how it appears.
It’s just an itch people might not want to rake over this often if they feel conflicted, or disagree, or just want to enjoy the racing? I learnt a long time ago with cancer survivors in my life that things might be more complex than my dislike of Armstrong at the time. So I’m simply imploring you to think about those in this community who have not been fans as long as you and I, who might not want to be told ad infinitum that their heroes are phonies and frauds nearly ten years since they last won – on a day when we should be celebrating Carapaz, Del Toro, Pogacar and others?
That’s it, I won’t post again, I won’t voice opinions next time you want to lambast Sky, I’ve said my peace. This is not about ignoring the truth, it’s just about allowing people to enjoy cycling however they choose.
@oldDAVE
You’re worsening thing. You’re defending being so considerate about everybody, then… oh, my.
To start with, as most people of our age, I’ve several cancer survivors around me, and had many a loved one who also just died of cancer, so I too know a thing or two about how Lance’s myth can be positively used – or not so, if it’s not the case. I even think (not sure of it) that some years ago I shared here how I myself used that rethorics in order to support my mother (who survived). That said, Livestrong was terribly rated by some no profit organisation who cares about investigating how and if other NGOs are actually using the money for the cause they defend. That sort of auditing of Livestrong gave awful insights on the organisation – also worth taking note (at least the couple of editions I was aware of back then, must admit that I didn’t follow up further on).
Then, the oh-so-base attempt to use for your argument(?)’s sake a false depiction of the other person. Scroll above and check. I’m not used to speak of Sky, unless in order to answer to some very specific assertion by other commenters, as in this case indeed.
Throwing in nationality is even more pathetic. Like what?, are you really implying that the use of English as an international koiné should oblige people from other countries to respect first and foremost English sensitivity, or if you prefer English pride & prejudice?
Finally, if anyone happens to comment with details that I have reasons to believe to be far from exact, I’ll just answer or let that go by. Be it about whatever. Of course, I’ll deliberately react on some themes which I consider to be worth of uncompromising public campaigning when they happen on the public scene, as they tend to be subject to manipulation like “the years 2012-2018, which I consider the only normal years in cycling’s recent history”, or “Armstrong doing what everyone else did” and that sort of things.
Plus, personal attacks, ça va sans dire.
Keeping it personal, if you (or anyone else) have issues with your sport heroes having doped, may I advice to keep as far as possible from pro sports.
Gabriele – I am asking for a little bit of kindness?
Sky nor Froome were racing today? Why are you intent on arguing about them? I’m not asking for English fans to be giving special privileges from their feelings being hurt – I’m saying it’s just strange behaviour when all this has been talked about so regularly already, to be so intent on constantly going after a team and cyclists who are more likely to have fans on a English language blog?
I’m giving you every benefit of the doubt that you don’t do it intentionally, and that you aren’t here to aggravate – I’m just saying surely you can give a rest when it’s completely irrelevant to the racing today?
I’m asking in the most polite way I can to just chill. There are no personal attacks, or whatever you think – I’m saying chill…. let it go.
Let’s talk about all the nice interviews after today’s stage, Charlie Wigelius talking about Carapaz, Sepp Kuss being magnanimous etc etc etc.
+1 Kemnard Lamna.
I find the tone of all this pretty aggravating, not that I’m one to get too upset about a blog comments section but ‘insult to intelligence’ etc is just a lightly concealed way to call all the rest of us idiots for trying to take some pleasure in a sport we all know the history of.
Whether Climber means it or not (I doubt it, as I know it’s easy to type quick and thoughtlessly when vexed), I feel like trying to find a slightly kinder way to voice grievances would be nice because it’s such a downer to come to a site I/we all love and be made to feel like fool for just enjoying something with the obvious caveats we all know already?
Thanks OldDave
OldDave & gabriele
Get a room
@Anon, you’re right… but you answered the wrong thread 😛
However, I’ll leave oldDAVE alone, so I’ll also be kind as he’s asking me.
@oldDAVE I totally agree with you (I’m English, was a cycling GT fan long before Sky and wasn’t a big Froome fan). Gabriele lets himself down badly with this Sky/Froome focus and the timing is especially poor.
@KevinR
I think that these reaction are delusional. I picked up on a subject which was already the theme of that thread and I actually *stopped focussing on that aspect* halfway through the debate, unlike you or Dave; the debate itself went on just because it went down the slope of a “classic oldDAVE” passive aggressive merely insulting attitude with no arguments added – which is precisely something I’ll always answer to, as in this case. Being myself insulting, too, but with arguments 😛
As it’s pretty manifest just checking my comments, Sky is far from being a focus of my contributions here, and my attitude on doping is rather acception of sort.
What I won’t accept is to apply this sort of generally healthy pattern, like, “each one to their opinion, we have no facts to discuss on”… when facts have actually surfaced.
So funny to see Anglos thinking this blog is somehow “English” cause it uses an international language.
It’s international, as are the commentators.
You don’t rule anymore.
I like this comment Binface – huge fan of both Lord Buckethead and Count Binface! I think you might need to visit Britain to realise how miserable and depressed things are here currently though! No one is under any illusion that we rule the world any longer… and I don’t think my comment quite said what you’ve read into it, but if the misinterpretation gave us a quick mention of an MP I hope will take his place in our parliament in the near future then it was worth it!
Let’s put the argument another way. In the same time period as Pantani was creating the three fastest ascents of Alpe d’Huez (before yesterday) he was also winning other races. In 1998 he won the Giro and Tour double. Now no one disputes really that Pantani was cheating – as were many of the top riders in the peloton at that time. On the Giro of 1998 Pantani climbed Piancavallo – a climb that takes a similar amount of time to Alpe d’Huez – in 36:20. The top four times for Piancavallo before this year were from that 1998 ascent in a known doping era. This year Jonas Vingegaard beat Pantani’s record by 5 seconds in the 2026 Giro. Is this evidence of anything? How can a modern non-doper beat a vintage doper?
I think our host makes a valid point in his comment. One huge difference today is that the fuelling of riders is completely different – and even from a decade ago. These guys are forcing god knows what into themselves to keep the engine topped up. I wince when reading accounts of riders having to “train” their digestive systems to accept what to me seems like abuse of the human body. Does it account for modern rides that are matching – and beating – the feats of the EPO-dominated 1990s? I’m not qualified to say. But I think the answer is more complex than arbitrarily picking a time and saying “no legal human can go faster than that”.
I have thought a bit about what would constitute good statistica evidence of doping. Assuming all riders are equally able to access the nutrition gains (carb loading) but some are doping and some are not, we could look for patterns in the times of the slower riders compared to the leaders. For example, the time of the 120th rider over a particular climb or in GC, compared over the years. In addition, we could compare riders in the MPCC teams vs those not in, and see if there is a significant difference within a Tour and also if there is a difference over the years, although budget does affect this.
For example, the 120th rider in 2016 was Markel Irizar, and his time was 3:58:17. This year, Mike Teunissen is 120th, currently at 5:28:48. Now, maybe 2016 was a lot easier than this year’s Tour, so it would be good to plot every years 120th finisher and see if there’s a trend line.
Gains in performance in the modern athletic era across all endurance sports) is largely down to the now widely accepted knowledge that fueling is king & the gateway to performance. High carbs (and the emerging science of lactate consumption as a different pathway to fueling than glucose/fructose) is making a huge difference. We are seeing times, FKT’s & course records being obliterated across road running, trail running, ultra running, triathlon & cycling as a result of this. I, for one, will reserve healthy judgement on the whole “suspicions” movement for now. During the doping era, those guys were, at most, going through 60g of carbs per hour. These days, gastrically well trained athletes in cycling are consuming 120g+, with some riders reporting substrate useage of up to 160g/hr of carbs. Faster you go, more fuel you need.
Pog would have to have spent more time in this tour on the front for Del Toro than Del Toro has spent on the front for him.
Yes, it’s been like watching a Dad and a kid out for a ride, with the Dad encouraging and urging his boy onward. Is this UAE succession planning ? (Could it also be tinged with an unwillingness to see Ayuso on the podium after the shenanigans last season?).
If Del Toro would be in trouble from Ayuso without a Pogi escort then the Mexican is in trouble.
It seems Ayuso is out of the running for the white jersey even without Del Toro’s team ‘support’ , but UAE didn’t know that at the start.
Del Toro admitted after the stage today he has been sick. Probably with the same bug that got Yates and McNulty.
That was quite an amazing feat by Pogacar. It was breathtaking to watch.
Regarding Martinez–I imagine, as you note, that Carapaz was frustrated by him, and he has done this sort of caboosing before. So does he have that reputation in the peloton? Does it come with a lack of respect? Or?
Unfortunately yes. reputation not great, same as his father (Miguel Martinez), a former MTB Olympic Champion, who was also quite disliked by his peers for his “wheel sucking” attitude. You might call this “race craft/ smart”, but it does not sit well within the peloton and your fellow riders..
His grandfather Mariano was like that too. There was a good interview with him last summer with radio station RMC for a series about the 50th anniversary of the polka dot jersey and he said one reason to ride the Tour was so have a month’s food for free, he counted every last centime. He’d fled poverty in Spain so perhaps understandable but the family, three generations, has a reputation, fair or not, for this.
Bahrain staff said yesterday they still wanted Martinez to go for GC yesterday. But if so then he should have ridden a more even tempo and kept the trio together for longer as he’d then have gained more time on the rest, and had a better shot at the stage win.
For me although he probably could have worked more, once he did come through and do turns Carapaz attacked him again.
Pogi should give Miguel an assist as Martinez repeatedly slowed the front group with his tactics. Looked like he was racing for second place from the bottom even when they had a 3+ minute lead.
Can’t wait to see Stage 20 and happy to read that the Col de Sarenne will be pardoned off from spectators, that sure seemed like a special sort of unspoiled place when my now wife and I visited last summer while out on tour. One of the trip’s highlights, glad we descended it vs climbing and we certainly took our time. Favorite memory was a snack break about halfway down in a tiny little cafe off to the right with a bicycle motif for the signage…..we stepped in, the Tour stage was on the TV inside as we snacked outside in the mountain sunshine, playful doggy on the hillside….bicycles can sure take you to amazing places. Thanks for all you do, Mr. Ring.
Sounds like quite a day. We dream of those days when we watch the Tour.
Can you expand on the playful doggy on the hillside?!
+1
Did the Alpe in 2006 in May and got there to find nowhere open to get anything eat.So we carried on over the Sarenne (had to push as the top was still covered in snow) and, like you, found the little café halfway down. By now it was about 2h30 and, being France, the kitchen was closed. Nevertheless they rustled up a plate of charcuterie and some crudités for almost nothing. These are the meals you remember! No dog that I remember….
I found it on the Google maps: 45°04’16.8″N 6°09’16.7″E
Auberge du Såvel, you can see the terrace umbrellas in the satellite view. There was friendly dog that had a frisbee and maybe a ball it would encourage youth toss..or not. Chill little spot. The whole trip was a peak lifetime experience, grateful we got it in. And this site’s Roads to Ride was a great resource for our full tour.
Just to say thanks to INRNG for the amazing coverage of TdF as always. When life gets in the way of keeping up with it every day this blog is a godsend!
Ditto
As a side note, how sad to see Alaphilippe trailing in next to last. All those years of aggressive racing seems to have worn him out. Will he want to go through with his final contract year in 2027?
Jalabert commented the near impossibility of overtaking on parts of the final climb. It’s dramatic but not really fair – particularly for Rubio.
Finally, Pogacar makes it look too easy for this impartial fan’s taste.
and the only time Pogacar slowed – relatively – was when being paced by Yates.
Are Alaphilippe’s numbers any worse than in 2019 or has he simply opted out of whatever is driving the incredible increases in speed in the years since then?
There’s gossip Tudor want to break his contract but that’s very rare in the sport; Groupama-FDJ might like to do the same with Gaudu but know they can’t as long as Gaudu says he is training, following their plans etc. See Froome and IPT and all those repeated interviews along the lines of “I’m working hard to get back” interviews.
Many sportsmen find stopping hard. Pinot stopped near the top but Froome, Maertens, Merckx and Kelly didn’t. It looks like Alaphilippe will join that latter elite group.
At least Tudor (the team) can talk to Tudor (the sponsor) about the potential to offer an fairly glamorous post-racing ambassadorial role to try and sweeten the retirement option for Alaphilippe.
Certain other teams, for example Soudal or Alpecin, have slightly less to offer.
Not getting bald while you retire into sealing your bathroom’s tiles?
Alaph is already acting as a Tudor brand ambassador, with lines like “he had always used Tudor”, which is a bit fun as half a dozen years ago he became one of the first cyclists to made headlines riding with a R. Mille.
Alaphilippe sat up on purpose. 2/3rds of the way up the Alpe yesterday he came past all by himself, just in front of the broom wagon with a stupid big grin on his face lapping up the adoration of the crowd and encouraging the Mexican waves. He knows that his time is up.
Pogacar did say before the start that Alpe d’Huez is “not that hard” of a climb … and so it went.
I would have enjoyed it more without all the vehicles and spectators all over the place. Huez is becoming a bit of a caricature of itself.
Yes it’s become better suited to an exhibition race, almost like a post Tour criterium, than a true competitive event.
Having cycled most of the main Alpine climbs (at a somewhat slower pace than we see from Pogacar), I’d say that in relative terms Alpe d’Huez is “easy” compared to the other HC climbs. The Galibier made me want to cry.
Lucky you John. Since the top of the Galibier is 800 meters higher than the top of the Alpe I confess that on my visit I could not catch my breath to cry!
I agree with every word John!
I would love to cycle these one day.
What about the Galibier got you specifically.
I’ve sadly only done the Pyrenees.
As a viewer the natural theatre of ADH is such a joy to watch, I’m glad we got more of a show this year than recent times too. It really feels like the home of cycling, I wish they could do more with the final section maybe to make it a touch more memorable – do a final 1km of yellow cobbles or something! It’s always a bit of a shame when you get over that final wall and things tail off.
(I would also have killed to know what the energy the final three riders were expending at during that final attack from Pog – I don’t really care about all the caveats, just to know what w/kg Pog, Carapaz, Martinez for the 10 second section when Pog dropped them would’ve been amazing.)
The Galibier is very exposed. We went in September and had a bit of snow at the top. And the higher elevation must have a big impact on the lungs.
It’s long, too. We were barely at walking pace by the end and it nearly became my second ever failed climb…the other being Winnats Pass with an awful headwind!
I found the switchbacks of Alpe d’Huez so helpful. From a mental point of view you know how much further there is to go. And from a physical side you can have a few seconds respite taking the wide route around the corners. I laughed yesterday watching Pogacar doing the exact opposite of that.
I cried on Ventoux. The forest was relentless and confining. And steep. Got to Chalet Renard with no food left. Painful day.
From Bedoin, Ventoux is awful. No flat spots on switchbacks to stop rest and fuel. Relentlessly snaking upwards like a snake, constant 8%+. It’s awful. And yes, much of it in the woods where you can’t even judge your progress. It broke me.
Died a hundred deaths on Galiber as well. It’s relentless in a different way (and still spots of snow in July!). Less switchback, just long sweeping curves that go on forever. And the altitude on the top 1/3 is no joke.
Huez is just great, other than the first few K which are awful. 21 switchback, numbered so you can count your progress, with a short flat bit to catch your breath or stop for a moment. Views improving with every turn.
+1 I find Ventoux very hard.
I didn’t check the profile of the Alpe or read anything much about it when I did it and got a bit of a shock at the gradient on the lower slopes that left me wondering for a bit how I was going to do that all the way up!!!
> I would have enjoyed it more without all the vehicles and spectators all over the place. Huez is becoming a bit of a caricature of itself.
I’d like to see the UCI commissaires hand a yellow card to Thierry Gouvenou for the course design (specifically, the inadequate security and crowd control) on Stage 19 that led to Elner Rubio’s crash, running up the back of a UAE team car which had stopped to avoid running over a spectator that fell in front of the car. Gouvenou has since blamed the team for using a modern car with too many safety sensors, implying that he thinks running over the spectator and maiming or killing them would have been a preferable outcome. Offence 8.2 to be used, as it covers “behaviour that is indecent or that endangers others.”
Plus a second one for the inadequate signage/marshalling at the roundabout which led to Jonas Vingegaard crashing out, the exposed kerb with the padded barrier uselessly sitting behind it that ended the race for Florian Lipowitz, and a fourth for the substandard barriers hit by Sepp Kuss that stopped just at the point where a rider just missing the racing line might need them.
Accumulating three or more within a period of 30 days or less would trigger an immediate 14 day ban from all involvement with the sport, therefore requiring a replacement (ideally someone independent) to join the organisation for the Tour Femmes and review the course design before it gets started. It isn’t possible to wind back time and reverse the injuries to Vingegaard, Lipowitz and Rubio, but it is never too late to reduce further harm.
INRNG,
I believe the map of Stage 20 in your description is an error?? It is a copy of Stage 19 map.
Should be fixed
I’m not sure about the Carapaz-Martinez imbroglio. Martinez certainly sat on Carapaz, but I’m not clear whether that was the cause of Carapaz’ attacks or a consequence of Carapaz’ fairly consistent record of sitting on other riders and then attacking/dropping them. Sometimes the best way to get cooperation is to demonstrate your own willingness to cooperate.
It backfired for him at last year’s Giro certainly – but even if they had worked together better, you kind of feel like Pog would have just ridden faster and/or caught them nearer the finish line. He’s not the cannibal, he’s the terminator!
Pog likely would have caught them anyway, but Carapaz really submarined whatever chance they had. The early attacks did nothing but destroy their cohesion and hasten the inevitable demise of the break. It sure would have been fun to see the three of them pulling through; at the very least it would have added to the drama.
Good point, I don’t think it is fair to put all the blame on Martinez alone, as Carapaz is quite a weird guy himself. I guess they were kind of the perfect match to certainly not make the best out of the situation. Unfortunately Sepp Kuss could not float away like S.Yates did on the Finestre.
I do hear what everyone here and on the podcasts is saying about Martinez being unpopular in the peloton for constant attacks and Carapaz being a bit wild also.
But…
It was incredible watching them yesterday??? Carapaz was so fantastic? That final attack to try and hold off Pog was maybe futile but so entertaining and said so much about him as a person and competitor.
I was in awe of all three yesterday and really, even if cohesion in the break would’ve been a better tactic, I wouldn’t have wanted to watch it any other way than what we did.
To me that was Carapaz’s greatest moment – to face almost certain defeat and attack anyway is the sort of craziness we all watch sport for! Chapeau to all the top3, it was a great show.
This.
Some example from that “consistent record”?
What I recall show pretty much the opposite – a generous rider, just with a great sense of timing which gives the impression the rest gets stuck behind when he goes.
What Frood comments below makes little sense, as shown in detail back then (Carapaz repeatedly tried to set some cooperation with Del Toro).
I’ve said it before, people who set off flares or smoke bombs should be prosecuted.
You’re right, and those who let them off are plain stupid.
Agreed. It must be hard enough spotting the race line through the hoards of berating flag-waving fans let alone through a smoke bomb. I’m the TV I spotted a few fans spraying water mist into the faces of the riders – I’m sure it’s being done with the best of intentions but I’m not sure I would want that either tbh.
I was cheering to see another strong ride in the mountains by Remco. Can’t blame him for not playing Icarus by following Tadej, and he took time on everyone else. As for Kuss, Martinez, and Carapaz, once Tadej made his move they were like supporting players in a horror film – the only thing missing was the theme music from Jaws.
When Pog set off my immediate snap judgement was that he would not catch them. Three of the better climbers three minutes in front? Surely not. Yet they didn’t work together and Carapaz, although he had the instinctive will to keeping trying to break away, couldn’t. Kuss was a passenger and knew that, of the three, he had the least explosivity. He was never going to win regardless of others. Martinez somewhat annoyed me. He clearly had the strength to win because he was on Carapaz everytime and the latter ended up burning himself out anyway. But Martinez was not smart. He should have gone when the DS was telling him Pog was coming. The break’s only chance was making it a sprint between them before Pog got too close.
A win for the break today? Our host’s chainrings suggest the usual suspects but I wonder how many of them have the strength left for 5400 meters of climbing battle? Carapaz will want to take points on at least the first three climbs to bag the polka dots but may need to go to the end if Valentin P-P has done his usual trick of sprinting for the points ahead of him. (He is 7 points behind Carapaz.) I see this being a case of how big a lead the break can get and how badly GC teams want or have the ability to keep it close. I read Tadej yesterday as saying he was going to nurse Del Toro to the podium and white jersey – and so it may turn out. The truth is IDT and Seixas seem fairly evenly matched and I doubt Decathlon have the firepower to mount a serious fight anyway. Of course, some GC rider making a full send and attacking on the Galibier, for example, could make this a stage for the ages. But can we get that lucky?
Am I too naive in thinking that the fans take their litter home with them on such a climb as Alpe d”Huez, or is it left as a living art installation of bottles, cans and associated litter? Just asking out of interest.
It’s all cleaned up by staff but sadly they have a big job to do. 30 tonnes in a report from a previous visit more recent than Fungineer https://france3-regions.franceinfo.fr/auvergne-rhone-alpes/isere/tour-de-france-2022-matelas-tentes-glacieres-des-tonnes-de-dechets-ramasses-dans-la-montee-de-l-alpe-d-huez-apres-le-passage-de-la-course-2582120.html
Thankyou. Disgraceful Imo.
They need a gang of Japanese football fans to get into cycling and help out.
A gang of Japanese officials would help even more or parents that raised their offspring “properly” to respect those around them.
Disgraceful is a bit harsh?
It’s just the way it is?
Yes all western countries could educate their people better to follow the Japanese example but we’ve know that many parties gain power by criticising ‘the nanny state’, so sadly it’s just too ingrained in our societies to make this kind of mentality shift – and I feel like these giant celebrations of sport and common humanity are still worthwhile so if there’s organisation to do clean ups like at ADH or Glastonbury that’s still okay?
I hear you though, it is frustrating that cleaning up after yourself gets lumped in with global warming and ‘nanny state’ waffle when there’s clearly a cross party consensus in most countries that tidying up after public gatherings is a good thing and we all look across at the Japanese and wish we’d did the same – so it would just be nice if we put some money into educating everyone from a young age to do so. It’s not going to happen anytime soon though and on balance I want these events to happen so if a government or organiser can afford/make sure a clean up happens that’s fine by me.
@anon. Disgraceful it certainly is.
I was there in 2004 (time trial won by Armstrong in the year that would have been his sixth overall win) and we went up the mountain three days running including the day afterwards. I don’t recall much litter on any of those days and if memory serves, on the last day, there was a road sweeper lorry cleaning any leftover litter as well as volunteers collecting from grass verges etc.
Here’s a French TV video (in French) from 1995 discussing this very topic:
https://mediaclip.ina.fr/en/grc9407219466-cleaning-of-the-road-after-the-tour-de-france-at-alpe-d-huez.html
Enjoyed reading this, thanks.
Wish I seen before commenting as this is a better post than what I wrote.
Today the Souvenir Henri Desgrange will be awarded. Does anyone know where the money for this award comes from? It would seem ASO, but some time ago I heard it was actually paid by Desgranges Estate/ surviving relatives. Maybe someone knows?
Also according to some sources it is a cash prize, what does that actually mean, does somebody just hand over an envelope of cash after the stage?
Haven’t heard of the source of the money.
For the payment it goes into a system for all the prize money with fines netted off. Then levied, eg to fund the CPA union, 2.7% of the prize pot goes to anti-doping, 2% to the rider retirement fund etc. Then paid to the teams and riders later on. As ever if a rider wins the €5k prize today they’ll be lucky if they actually see €500 in their bank after levies, taxes and sharing among team mates/staff.
Do we know what gearing pog was using yesterday? I believe pantani was on a 39 x 21 or 23 ( 7 speed block)
And for the guy who mentioned hinault/lemons 48 minutes in 1986, having broken Zimmerman earlier they just rode up at tempo not racing
At those speeds, a 39×21 is as suited as anything else. Pantani probably had up to 25, anyway, but I doubt he’d use it on the Alpe. I doubt that Pogi ever used anything lighter than a 38×23 yesterday (he’s using agility, but rarely showing extreme RPM, by the way).
As John said above, in itself Alpe d’Huez is not that hard a climb.
From that POV, Coppi was most shocking, indeed, as his 45′ time.
What are details of Coppi’s climb? I actually know nothing about this, do you have times and speeds and stuff? Would love to know more.
Coppi won when the TDF first climbed the AdH.
Of course, no asphalt at all.
9,5 kg bike.
He didn’t knew the climb but a French cyclist had explained him a bit about it, so Coppi said he chose an “agile” set of speeds, hence probably 50/47 (or 46) on the front, up to 22 or 24 teeth cogs behind. I’d have said “agile” meant 24 but the over 250 kms long stage was mainly flat and choosing a 24 could mean you wouldn’t have anything fast enough on the flat.
So he had at most what currently would be a 39×18 or 39×20.
His time was taken on the 14.5 km climb, so he went up at some avg. 19 km/h.
Interestingly, the difference between 47 and 50 isn’t huge, and indeed in the photos you can often see him on the big ring, probably pushing a 50×22 at some 23-24 km/h in the “easiest” parts when you can get speed.
His rival Robic also made a great time. Many sensed that Coppi hadn’t gone full speed as long as he had Robic on his wheel.
The following day they had a super mountain marathon, Coppi went alone on the first or second big col out of five, I think, and goodbye everybody.
History of the Alpe d’Huez:
https://www.maillotmag.com/afondo/esa-montana-de-21-curvas-la-historia-de-alpe-dhuez
Coppi of course would have been on amphetamines (and other things perhaps) – he said so himself. Very potent doping agent.
Amphetamines aren’t that good, really, in an endurance event held across three weeks. They were long perceived to be useful, of course, as their use became generalised in post war cycling and all the way to the 80s, but that’s like building up a company on growing debts. Oh, wait, that’s what most companies actually do 😛
Some info on Coppi from back-then press:
https://cyclinside.it/il-coppi-che-non-si-conosce-bici-alimentazione-posizione/
Feeding was paramount of course ^___^
Thank you, really enjoyed this, it would be so special to watch today’s coverage with those eras to really understand what they went through.
I heard Geraint Thomas calling today’s stage the hardest ever, but couldn’t help thinking that those preWW2 seemed utterly outrageous.
If G. Thomas really said this is just laughable, and you needn’t even go that far back. People’s senses are seriously affected by the mere fact of doing a podcast, it seems.
I know some tuned out of this tour when it felt decided, and yesterday was the real firework stage – but I loved today.
Ayuso giving it a go deserves a lot of credit, great to see him fighting as I have questioned his fighting spirit at times in his career so far.
Jai Hindley showed up on the final day which was nice, great rider, rarely gets the praise he deserves, I never imagined he would win a Giro after losing to Tao so always like seeing him at the fore.
Carapaz was so brilliant yesterday and always fights so I’m becoming an even bigger fan even if he often seems quite angry!
Shame for Sepp but I love these final stages in the Tour where some of the best riders find form and show their quality. What a rider.
Remco has had a stand out race, he really deserves so much credit for this second place, I think this is far more impressive than his third a few years back, he had a lot going against him.
Pogacar is just a brilliant human being the way he supports Del Toro, it’s quite weird to watch the yellow help a teammate but just shows he has such a kind heart.
Seixas tried and failed today, but even to try at 19 is crazy impressive.
& Martinez, love seeing him in the mix, he’s like a little pixie (I say that affectionately) and I like how these tiny french riders quickly grow a George Michael style beard when they hit their early twenties to man up! Would love to see him win a big classic one day, or something for his palmares to shine in a era of mega talents.
Overall really pleasant final climbing stage, the tour always leaves such a warm feeling by the close, feels like the last day of school!
Thank you for all the great comments throughout INRNG regulars! Enjoy the chat.
Is that what you think Ayuso was doing? I think he was getting out in front so as not to lose another bunch of time like yesterday. And it worked, relatively speaking, but he’s still finished 8 minutes behind Del Toro and 6 minutes behind Seixas overall.
By all means praise Remco if you must but he would have been third if Jonas hadn’t crashed and he has done nothing but what would have been expected of him overall. His stage win was at least half a gift and the ITT he should win. Today again he clipped off when no one was going to chase him anyway.
PS whilst I understood why Pog nursed Del Toro to the finish it was completely unnecessary once Seixas was distanced. Earlier in the week you called Remco a “killer” which gave me a laugh. Its Pog who is the real killer except today he chose to be a pussy cat and that spoiled my enjoyment a little. Pog could have won that stage too.
Sorry i think you may not have seen my previous comments here – which is totally understandable, I’ve been commenting for a number of years on this blog and the above may not give the full context of my views!!
I am generally quite down on Remco, I feared before this tour that he was sliding away from being a GC candidate and along with many others expected him to be distanced by Lipowitz and struggle to make the podium. Yes in a sense he’s only achieved what was expected but this is a success from where things seemed to be heading in the last few years in my view. I still think he will find it hard as both Del Toro and Seixas improve but he’s silenced a few doubters like me with this ride and it’s nice to see people surprise you.
As for killer, I’m likely one of Pogacar’s biggest fans here, he’s of course a killer! But you also have to remember Pog has the power to be a killer, and when Remco is in a race where he has the power and any chance of a win, then he’s very reliable – see his one day victories. You give him a sniff, he often delivers but it usually without Pog present. So I think he’s a killer also, even if he might have been gifted a win here and chipped off the front today when Pog was nursing Del Toro. It’s all about context.
As for Ayuso, yes I agree there’s as much chance he was trying to get up the road as there is he was trying to take time – but to me both are fighting? Ayuso feels like he’s under delivered regularly so far in his career and previously has seemed to give up at times when you want to see some Carapaz-esq fighting spirit – and today I felt he showed some whatever the reason was? *(I should add that by questioning any riders fighting spirit I’m being a bit daft, as all of them have had to fight to be where they are!)
@oldDAVE I think Remco has taken a huge step forward for climbing with the best and not having a very bad day in the high mountains with multiple climbs, which has generally been his Achilles heel. Clearly not a big enough step to come close to worrying Pog and probably not Vinny while the next generation aren’t going away. But he must have put in a lot of work to achieve this. With the right parcours and rivals, there’s a Giro win in him or another Vuelta success.
Agree. It’s funny, and possibly unsportsmanlike, that Pogi finds Remco so irrelevant that he’d rather nurse Torito to the line than to just beat Remco again. If I were Remco I’d be offended. It’s like he’s not even being offered a crack at the honest win. Again, a pseudo-gift.
Interesting that Pog puts so much craft-sharing to DelToro, IMO looking “down the road” for loyalty, when Seixas will be more developed. Top ten for the latter at 19 is a great start, of course. But extrapolate if you will to see his potential as the future best threat to Pog.
I say this realizing that none of it is a new thought, but this dynamic is what Pog is made of. Not so much the present assistance, but he does seem to “see” the future pretty darn well.
Just to play Devil’s Advocate, who is to say that Seixas isn’t already very close to his ceiling?
I find Pogacar’s insistence on holding his junior team mates hand for the sake of a third place and a white jersey that absolutely nobody will remember a bit of a turn off. Three stages he has gifted that he blatantly could have won. If he genuinely is the greatest of all time, which he certainly appears to be, I’d rather he went out and showed it rather than gifting people hollow victories. Del Toro is good enough to fend for himself, Pogacar hanging around like a dad who has been talked into taking his son for a ride is demeaning to both Del Toro and the race. Del Toro will either go on to win many many more races, or he’ll peter out. Either way the fact that he finished 3rd and won the white jersey once won’t really matter.
LOL, we were writing at the same time. I would agree with you if only the present time were the frame of this story. But what do you think a 2028 or 9 Tour will shape? IMO Pog will soon reach a terminus of fitness, and that may begin a tide of true (closer) rivalry.
Do you not think we should factor in the race and months of prep/camaraderie Richard S? They’ve been living and breathing this for a number of months and likely rooming together… they’ve just climbed 5000m and a probably a tiny bit tired… I don’t know about you but I am extremely british and very much not a hugger but when I’m on my knees physically I am slightly more inclined to want and give a hug to celebrate so kind of very minor achievement!? (far more minor than what they’ve just done!)
We watch these races from our sofas, but I think living it for months brings a different kind of collegiate spirit that might seem annoying on the TV, yet would be understandable if we’d experienced it with them? Also, maybe we Brits aren’t that big a fans of hugs and kisses but other cultures are so we shouldn’t be too mean!!
I do though share *(as you’ll have seen from my comment that day Remco won) seeing the Yellow jersey helping a lower teammate can be a tiny bit of a shame, but as he gave us a show yesterday, so I didn’t begrudge it today. I thought it was pretty nice to see. If we’d been watching this everyday for the last week I would share your opinion entirely.
I didn’t see them hug after the line, thats not what I am referring to. I’m not in my 80s, I can handle more than a firm handshake. I meant Pogacar guiding him to the line like a dad wanting to make sure his son doesn’t get lost on the reliability ride. And whilst Del Toro may have been tired I very much doubt Pogacar was. He’s well above such earthly concerns. Basically, I’d just rather he had chased Carapaz so we would have had a true race. Not that it matters.
Maybe you’re right – I do get your view.
It didn’t bug me today, but it’s understandable.
Sorry if I sounded like I was talking to you like you were 80!
My view was if Pog had done what Remco did he would have won the stage. As I expressed earlier, the unnecessary mollycoddling of IDT made no sense once Seixas was two minutes behind. And I don’t see what credit of any kind Pog gets for it either. IDT likely finished where he would have anyway. I’m not sure Pog will end up regretting all the gifts but if he’s after Cav’s stage record he should wait until after he has 36 first.
I’m not sure I follow.
Again, I’d be pissed if I was Remco. Or maybe this gets the Belgian press off his back and he couldn’t care less.
Can’t reply to the end of this conversation, so this is not directly to Richard S.
In any case, whatever the sporting merits of Pogacar’s assistance to del Toro, it was, to my mind, a rather remarkable act of friendship. It’s almost like he thought “it’ll be more fun, and more memorable to me, to cross the line with my friend and make the silly bull horns gesture than it would be to win another stage, which everyone knows I could have done anyway…”
And judging by Pogacar’s post-stage comments, it was almost as if his assistance to del Toro was a stand in for returning all the work his teammates have done for him in this race and all year. You don’t often hear the degree of gratitude that he expressed after the stage.
It’s kind of amazing that he could have finished this race with 3 more stage wins than he will have. Most club riders can’t even finish a conversation at the coffee shop without proving themselves right in an argument one more time much less be willing to give up 3 stage wins.
@cp I think you’re right. We don’t look at it from our sofas like the riders involved do, especially Pog. They can have different, personal motivators and drivers that we just can’t understand or relate to because we’re not in their world – the Tour (or any GT) is just the tip of iceberg and the only bit we really see other than the odd prep race.
If Pog had chased everybody down and won this stage as well no doubt some people would have complained . He can’t please everybody can he .
Not much to say about the racing today, but I hope I can be forgiven for trying to be a bit philosophical. As an unapologetic Visma partisan, this Tour has been a 20-day nightmare (ok, maybe only 19) and today’s events were the cyanide-laced cherry upon a cake made of (Mads Pedersen’s favorite word). I will not remember this Tour with fondness, and while I respect the accomplishments of the riders on the podium I take no joy in them (although I would love Del Toro on any other team). I know this sounds bitter and awful, and I know that there’s another perspective that “it’s all simply amazing and they’re all good lads,” but that’s not for me. I’ll take the gut punch as an occupational hazard of someone who loves to get invested in sport. Sometimes it’s your day and everything is glorious, sometimes you eat a $@&! sandwich. My only concern is that the playing field stays relatively level, which is a legitimate concern, but otherwise I guess I’ll be content to lick my wounds and hope for better things to come.
Totally fair, enjoyed reading.
I was rooting for Carapaz, but the ending to today’s drama was rather terrible. In the end, Carapaz deserved the stage for his third week heroics, but Kuss certainly didn’t deserve to bottle it like a vintage Tottenham team. When in rains it pours, for Visma.
Spurs? Fra sticking the knife in and twisting 😆
@The Other Craig. I understand and sympathise with your post. Although not a rabid Visma supporter i certainly dislke seeing uae, bahrain or alula at the tour. “and while I respect the accomplishments of the riders on the podium I take no joy in them”
As oldDAVE decided that nationalism has to play a role on this blog, here are a couple of stats on nationalities 😉
– unless tomorrow we get some surprise, for the *very first time in history*, no Italian, French or Spaniard will win even a single stage at the TDF.
The three countries are struggling quite much to fight for TDF stage victories in the so-called “post 2020 cycling”, unlike Belgium or the Netherlands.
Actually, we had got very close to the null score in 2021 and 2022, when a single French win each “saved the day”. 2013 and 2016 also had been close calls, whereas in the past normally if some of those three countries was struggling it meant that one of the others was grabbing the stage opportunities, for example from the end of the 70s to halfway through the 80s when the French were on the fore as Italy and Spain were declining.
Things come and go, the Belgian and Dutch had had a dry season approximatedly mid 00s to mid 10s.
– unless Remco crashes out, tomorrow it will be the first time in 45 years that a Belgian finishes a TDF as the runner-up, Van Impe 1981 behind Hinault being the previous one. I’d even go as far as to say we haven’t had any Belgian climbing a TDF GC podium, as Van Den Broeck 2010 had been actually 5th on the road.
It’s hard to mirror how brutal was the shift for the Belgian after the 70s… not only they had had Merckx, but they were also used to be around in GC podia with a variety of good athletes who maybe never became serial winners but could be there in a fine season. In the 60s they had endured a very short break between Planckaert and Merckx, but then it wasn’t just Eddy – they could count on Van Springel, Bracke, Van Impe, Maertens, De Muynck, Pollentier, Criquelion…
Between 1968 and 1982 both included they never had a season without any GT podium, and some years like 1970 or 71 the Belgian occupied 4 or 5 out of 9 total available podium spots across the 3 GTs – thanks to Merckx? Yes, but even if you totally discount him, you’re left only with 1969, 1973 and 1974 lacking any Belgian on a GT podium – only 3 out of 15 seasons, and, let me insist, that’s if you “cancel” Merckx.
They never podiumed again until the 3rd spot at the 1995 Vuelta (!) by Johan Bruyneel (!!!) racing for the super-ONCE. Not a contender, anyway. After 14 years of total void.
Then again, De Gendt at the Giro 2012. 18 years later. Again, not exactly a pure GT contender.
This says quantity about the weight of the context which GT cyclists have to face in Belgium. And it’s not like they don’t try to “nurture” that kind of rider: in recent years I recall Vansevenant, De Plus, Van Eetvelt, Van Wilder, Vervaeke, Vandenabeele, sadly Lambrecht (a whole different story) all being hugely promising than turning out not really potential GT contenders. And what will be of Uijtdebroecks…?
Next? Widar? (More a Lenny of sort maybe) – Van Kerckhove? Vanhuffel?
Tighten it up, gabriele, the delete button is your friend 😝. As for your main point, that’s actually really crazy. I had been wondering why this Tour felt so weird, and even though there are lots of other reasons, the absence of stage winners from the traditional hotbeds of cycling (minus Belgium of course) feels like something new. In the same vein, seeing Movistar and FDJ struggle so badly is kind of sad. As Maureen pointed out on another post, the Aussies have been pretty absent as well. Jayco did get their stage winner, but he wasn’t Australian. Sadly the American drought didn’t end today, but that’s not terribly surprising. But it looks like the French won’t be waiting very long for a serious yellow jersey fight, and it will likely be against a Mexican. Now that would be a welcome change!
I think they will be waiting a while yet. And for that reason the French/Mexican showdown may never materialise.
At least Movistar were up there several times in some finales, I can’t recall anything from FDJ, it was very Bardiani.
Gregoire has had a good first half of season but he looked spent here.
An anecdote from some third week stage sums up Movistar’s situation and spirit: Unzué senior speaking from the team car’s window and telling his rider (Castrillo or García Pierna) “man, have you seen who’re you here with? Hang with them as much as you can then let go, you’ve already done great”.
The French are having a dry spell in stage wins, but GC is being fine, a possible future contender, a solid GC hope (as long as he lasts) and some working class man to make it 3/10.
Their cycling movement is very healthy, obviously not every shiny young star becomes an established one (Gaudu, Champoussin, Madouas, APP, Zingle, Lafay, Cosnefroy, although maybe he’s having some boost at UAE, etc.) but they’ve got a solid production chain which sooner or later is going to deliver.
Quite the opposite for Italy, whereas Spain sits in between, now struggling but the underlying structure hasn’t been reduced to ruins as in Italy.